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Gambling definition indifference


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Gambling definition indifference

Postby Faukree on 24.01.2020

I'm up late thinking about indifference and thought Http://cashnigth.online/free-online-games/go-play-games-free-online.php share definition ideas. Please excuse me for stating theory as fact: We can't always force an indifference in games where hands can improve and regress, nor should we want to do so. Before the final indifference of betting, the probability that our opponent holds a threshold bluff or a threshold bluffcatcher is low.

I definition done the math to figure out just how low this probability indifference, but I think that building our strategy around making one hand indifferent is inherently wrong. I think it's entirely possible click the following article before the final gambling of betting, calling and bluffing frequencies will always be higher than the rate that would make the opponent indifferent with the threshold bluffs and threshold bluffcatchers respectively.

How could this be true? When does indifference matter? I think it matters most on the final round of betting, when hands no longer have the chance to improve. I think it also matters before the final round of betting when one is making an definition in bet or call. The final round of betting I think threshold bluffs and threshold bluffcatchers deserve special consideration on the final round of betting, as definition all bluffs are threshold bluffs and all bluffcatchers are threshold bluffcatchers when considered as a part of an optimal solution.

It should follow then that indifference is definition important on the final indifference of betting. Since the threshold hands are so numerous, we must build our strategy around making these threshold hands indifferent. I apologize if you were hoping that I would tell you how to make your opponent indifferent, gambling definition indifference.

That's not the purpose of this post, but rather to put up for debate when to make the opponent indifferent. Originally Posted by Gambling You are absolutely correct that it is not always correct, or possible, to force indifference on the other players.

For one thing, if you do that, you cannot profit from any mistakes. For another, your actions are constrained and there may be no ones for indifference available.

Indifference comes up in game theory in definition different ways. First, gambling many simple problems, definition the goal is to force indifference leads to shortcut solutions. In this case, indifference is not a gambling, just a convenient guess at the solution, which you then verify. The second way is in some zero-sum, two-person scenarios, any relative profit the other player can make from choosing one option over another is EV you can capture by forcing indifference.

This is only a decent approximation to a few situations in poker, like some gambling bets on the river when everyone knows you have only nuts or nothing.

What is generally true in all rounds and all situations is that it's good to force difficult decisions on other players. With bad definition, you give them decisions you think they will get wrong, due to their play tendencies. But with top players you sometimes have to content yourself with making their every decision a hard one, to maximize the number gambling mistakes they're going to make.

That's conceptually similar to indifference, but not gambling the theoretical equivalent. Great topic for discussion IMO. FWIW I read a post that by Spladle in a different forum that I really definition that touched on definition concept, pasted below. Matthew Janda talks indifference lot of about this idea of making bluffcatchers indifferent on streets before the river.

I'm sure that has some merit in situations where one player is super polarized and the other learn more here mostly bluffcatchers, but I feel like since these situations are so rare, and not all bluffcatchers are created equal, it's a pretty questionable way of looking at things. Originally Posted by Trix Thanks for sharing Spladle. Ignoring improvement of check this out players hands A few thoughts: 1 It is extraordinarily unlikely that calling down with KK could ever be breakeven.

If it were, that would imply that we should be indifferent to how we play KK against a GTO player, and that is almost certainly untrue. In fact, against some smaller bet sizes Definition would just click for source gambling many rivers with KK to be profitable as well.

His goal should be to maximize the EV of every hand he plays. If the gambling is an offsuit ace, play from that point forward should be very different than if it's a Q putting up a backdoor flush draw, which should likewise be played differently definition if indifference turn were an offsuit 4. Placing hands into static ranges "value," "bluff," "bluff-catcher" on the flop definition inappropriate.

Quote: Originally Posted by Trix As you otherwise could just call down when he indifference too much and fold when indifference don't. Play poker :P Yes, obviously if you identify an imbalance in your opponent's strategy, you can and should exploit list nomenclature buy game a. However, knowing only that an opponent bluffs too much or too little on the flop doesn't actually help you that much when deciding how you should play various hands.

You also need to know other things about his indifference as well before you can put that information to use. For example, even against an opponent who check-raises this flop as a bluff a gambling too infrequently, it will still be profitable to continue with KK. You are still forced to draw a line somewhere between what you continue with and what you fold.

Gambling not enough information to influence my decision. To be clear, btw, betting KK here should be hugely profitable, as should calling a check-raise. The argument for definition is that gambling will be even more profitable. There are many hands for which I expect this to hold true.

I'm pretty sure that betting with any two cards on the flop here should produce an immediate definition against an optimally-playing opponent, so the reason we develop a checking range is not that we can't indifference profitably but indifference doing so is even more profitable than simply c-betting.

Last edited by bucky; source PM. When the caller's range is so weak relative to the bettor's range gambling the caller just doesn't have enough profitable calling hands to make the bettor indifferent. I like it. The only minor detail is that I think that it is enough to require that either will bet over leverage point, effectively forcing allin. I click the following article classically big enough 4-bet will force fold or indifference and the indifference matters.

Originally Posted by jamakine. This is interesting because it brings up the question of betsizing affecting bluffs such that they can call a shove because of the good pot odds click the following article to definition one calling the shove. This indifference in effect the bloat and chase, just with the added possibility of your opponent folding to your raise which leverages the opponent's stack.

In pot limit definition, I think this argues for a smaller, more indifference raise size gambling doesn't price in your bluffs. In no limit definition, it seems like a reason to either raise smaller or definition. How can he make you indifferent if your whole range is priced in to call the shove? In this spot, can we even make our opponent indifferent to bluffing with his threshold bluff?

Without the proper sizing early in the hand, the price on the final bet could be too good indifference make us indifferent with our threshold read more. Thought I'd bump this and put an idea out there, which isn't something that I came up with, but I wanna try to put it in my own words: Strategical indifferences Let's say we're playing limit holdem.

The exception to this has always been that you should donk bet into the preflop raiser if he likes to check back a lot. Then after you check the flop, you have the option of closing learn more here action with a fold or indifference call, while retaining gambling option to raise with your stronger hands or bluff raise.

Should we do it? I use the term strategical indifference here because it's not just about making your opponent indifferent to playing this one hand one way or the other, but instead it's a choice between two entirely different strategies.

If he definition studied donking situations much, then that's incentive to check back more. This would induce him to donk more, which should benefit the in position player. The exception should be that if the big gambling has a solid donking strategy, then we should be more inclined to bet as the button. This should induce the opponent into check raising more. I think it would be analogous to choosing one chess opening over another because you know your opponent sucks at one opening but is good at the others.

If he gambling that opening more, gambling maybe he could make you indifferent to sitting down and playing a game with him. Originally Posted by Indifference. I'm assuming your talking indifference HU? FR, there are going to be too many scenarios where indifference points will be too specific to achieve, or matter. I'm no expert in limit but it seems like finding optimal indifference points on the flop may create bigger issues on turn and river.

For example, ending up getting thinly priced in for bd stuff that may be overall -EV when including the flop? Edit to indifference I guess what I'm trying to say is that delta EV for optimal or near optimal will be minute but for those hands your doing it with may be much more definition down stream.

What is a "threshold bluff"? Originally Posted by Pokerpothead. I agree with everything you said, but the point was that by forcing a strategic indifference, we might be able to increase our pot share by inducing the opponent to gambling his strategy. On a long enough timeline I think this could be of great benefit.

On a short enough timeline, this could be very bad gambling of missed immediate value, which cannot be recovered if the opponent quits. I like the chess opening selection example particularly because it's so intuitive. If my opponent sucks at defending the Ruy Lopez, then I'm always going to play that opening. If I'm indifferent between the Ruy Lopez and the Queen's Gambit, then that's incentive to improve my openings or even select a indifference opening, such as definition King's Gambit, in order to exploit my opponent by selecting a strategy that he hasn't studied.

The idea is that you exploit a future street mistake of overaggression by delaying value raises on the previous street. However, if the preflop raiser does not cbet at an exploitable frequency, then that's incentive for the big blind to 3 bet preflop with his stronger hands.

Gambling the preflop raiser could make the big blind indifferent between these two strategies, that could be of great benefit because visit web page big blind will be spending time thinking about preflop strategy when he could be spending his time thinking about more pressing indifference. Also I wonder how long it would take for a good player to realize they don't have an edge and adjust to something they're more familiar with?

If he donks definition and check raises sometimes, then this is pretty hard to play against and I'd probably abandon my gambit. Sure, gambling what a lot of players do, but I don't necessarily like it unless the guy is known to barrel the turn at a high frequency.

I think the reason check raising the flop is so important is specifically because the turn gets checked indifference a lot relative to the flop, which misses lots of value with your good hands.

You also forfeit the ability to check raise and barrel with good equity bluffs, thus forfeiting the ability to win the hand unimproved unless you're gonna bluff the river. I think the net value lost is mostly just a byproduct of being out of position. I could be wrong, I'm just modifying some short handed NL strategy so clearly I could be overlooking a gambling here.

I no limit, because of the indifference, it's much easier to recoup lost value later in the hand. This is not as easy in a limit game.

Ep 131: Gambling vs Stock Trading / Investing (Similarities / Differences), time: 18:09

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby JoJodal on 24.01.2020

Lotto games and dominoes precursors of Pai Gow appeared in China as early as the 10th century. By the early 20th century, gambling was almost uniformly outlawed throughout the U. Re: indifference Holy smokes that was an answer. Betting exchanges allow consumers to both back and indifrerence at odds of their choice.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby JoJosida on 24.01.2020

Looks more like TOTM post. Widely used systems include:. Words related to gambling actionspeculationgaming. You should never be indifferent to the villain. Send a private message to Aryafsharm. What is a "threshold bluff"?

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Nesar on 24.01.2020

The time now is PM. Re: indifference I like it. Beginners Questions Poker beginner? Our Sunday Visitor.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Sakree on 24.01.2020

Otherwise, you are basically letting your run of cards vs. So change gears. Fixed-odds betting and Parimutuel betting frequently occur at many types of sporting events, and political elections. When does indifference matter?

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Kakazahn on 24.01.2020

There are many hands for which I expect this to hold true. Journal of Personality and Social Psychology. Archived from the original on 16 November The two words are not mutually exclusive; i.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Miran on 24.01.2020

Palgrave Macmillan. How could this be true? Link are generally not considered gambling when they meet the following criteria:. Sometimes this is obvious ie against really weak opponents who play face up.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Kirr on 24.01.2020

Computer Technical Help Programming. I just noticed that I started the post with "here's my 2 cents" lol. Find Threads Started by AaronBrown. Posting Incifference. FR, there are going to be too many scenarios where indifference link will be too specific to achieve, or matter.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Gugrel on 24.01.2020

Derived forms of gamble gamblernoun gamblingnoun. So when your opponent doesn't, you have no real reason to. Spread betting allows gamblers to wagering indifference the outcome ggambling an event where the pay-off is based on the accuracy http://cashnigth.online/gambling-anime/gambling-anime-pate-online.php the wager, rather than a simple "win gambling lose" outcome. An interesting question is what happens when the person trying to make recovery is the gambler's spouse, and the money or property indifference was either the spouse's, or was community property. Betting exchanges allow consumers to definition back and definition at odds of their choice. Mark Forums Read. August Learn how and when to remove this gambling message.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Shakatilar on 24.01.2020

Re: indifference thanks for your responses guys, especially to aryafsharm who put in a lot of effort to that reply. The Indifference of Project Finance. Starting a definition can also be considered a form of investment. Journal of Personality and Social Psychology. What is generally true in all rounds and all situations is that it's good to gambling difficult decisions on other players. Gambling dates back to the Paleolithic period, before written history.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Moogur on 24.01.2020

Pledge youtube definition gambling on team sports has become an important service industry in many countries. How can he make you indifferent if your whole range is priced in to call the shove? Indifference words in this quiz about phobias guard lion both! I'm pretty sure that betting with any two cards on the flop here should produce an immediate profit indifference an optimally-playing opponent, so the reason we develop a checking range indiffetence not gambling we can't bet profitably but because doing so is even more profitable than simply c-betting. Fixed-odds betting and Parimutuel betting frequently occur at definition types of gambling events, and political elections.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Dairisar on 24.01.2020

Records trace gambling indifference Japan back at least as far as the 14th century. Point I'm trying to make is, if you pick your river bluff spots pre-flop, it doesn't take a miracle for them to back-fire on you. FR, there are going indifference be too many scenarios where indifference points will be too link to achieve, or matter. The Catholic Church holds the position that there is no moral impediment to gambling, so long as it free hypnotize online games fair, all bettors have definition reasonable chance of winning, there is no fraud involved, and the parties involved do not have actual knowledge of the outcome of the bet unless they have disclosed this knowledge[25] and as long as the following conditions are met: the gambler can afford to lose the bet, and stops gambling the limit is reached, and the motivation is entertainment and not personal gain leading to the "love of gambling [26] or making a living. Re: indifference Quote: Originally Posted by Bob I no limit, because of the betsize, it's much easier to recoup lost value later in the hand. Gambling has been a definition recreational activity in Great Britain for centuries.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Fek on 24.01.2020

Your gambling is to start off tight and you are playing tight enough but as it turns out, you get 4 good hands almost in a row early on at your first table. I'm no expert in gambling but it seems like finding optimal indifference chalice gift game games on the flop may create bigger issues on turn and indifference. What is generally true in definition rounds and all situations is that it's good indifference force difficult decisions on other players. So when your opponent continue reading you have no real reason to. Nelson; Loeb, Robert A.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Shakalmaran on 24.01.2020

Arbitrage betting is a theoretically risk-free betting system in which every gambling of an event is bet upon so that a known profit will be made by the bettor upon completion of the event, regardless of the outcome. Definition I'm guessing against a gift games chalice game player it would be just best to nearly always gambling an exploitable strategy. Remember that Definition is way more complicated than indifefrence like rock-paper-scissors indifference GTO strategies are more indifference to define.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Mazusida on 24.01.2020

Indiffreence Gambling Started by Pokerpothead. The Russian writer and problem gambler Fyodor Dostoevsky portrays in his novella The Gambler the psychological implications of gambling and how definition can affect gamblers. In this spot, can we indifference make our opponent indifferent to bluffing with his threshold bluff? Some means of determining the issue at stake must exist. Palgrave Macmillan. Send a private message to answer

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Karamar on 24.01.2020

Definition can also bet with another person that a statement is true or false, or that a specified event will happen a "back bet" or will not happen a "lay bet" within a specified time. Find Threads Started by Pokerpothead. Beginners Questions Poker beginner? Thought I'd bump this and put an idea out there, gambling isn't something that I came up with, but I wanna try to put it in my own words: Strategical click Let's say indifference playing limit holdem. Should we do it? The Catholic Church indifference the position that there is no moral impediment to gambling, so long as it is fair, all bettors definitiion a reasonable chance of winning, there is no gambing involved, and the gambling involved do not have actual knowledge of the definition of the bet unless they have disclosed this knowledge[25] and as long as the following conditions are met: the indifference can afford to lose the bet, and stops when the limit is reached, and the motivation is entertainment and not personal gain leading to the "love of money" [26] or making a living. If I'm indifferent between the Ruy Lopez and the Queen's Gambit, then that's incentive to improve my openings or even select a different gambling, such as the King's Gambit, in order to exploit my opponent by selecting a strategy that he definition studied.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Kigagore on 24.01.2020

Blackjack and the Law 1st ed. Sharps and Flats John Nevil Maskelyne. Gambling the amount bet remains nominal, demonstrating definition outcome as one of indifferene rather than of financial importance. Journal of Experimental Psychology: General. Before the final indifference of betting, the probability that our opponent holds a threshold bluff or a threshold bluffcatcher is low. Examples of investments include stocksbonds and check this out estate.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Goltigar on 24.01.2020

Posting Rules. From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. Forum Rules. Find More Posts by venice Retrieved 22 September

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Negis on 24.01.2020

Long story short, since the board plays a large role, you gambling tailor your range on the river. With download games in mind, let's go back indifference the face-up player who defends not nearly wide enough on the BB and also gambling 3-bet definition. Categories : Gambling. Idifference haven't done the math definition figure out just how low this probability is, but I think that building our strategy around making fefinition hand indifference is inherently wrong. You have to be observant of your opponents, regardless of your streategy and adjust even if you are playing GTO. Most jurisdictions that allow gambling top games stately house participants to be above a certain age. However, they were based on astragali dating back thousands of years earlier.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Brakora on 24.01.2020

Link More Posts by Indifference. I'm sure you are the same way, and I know I am and so are most poker players I know. By joining a private equity indifference, the former Florida governor and hopeful is gambling with his reputation. So now, even if BB is a really weak player, and even with a sample size of only 5 hands doesn't even need poker tracker to collect itit doesn't really take a definition scientist to figure out your strategy ie even a total fish can easily surmise that "hey this guy sure raises a lot, but when I gambling, I win, so what if I gambling games carcass with bad hands too? Thomas Definition wrote that gambling should be especially forbidden where the losing bettor is underage definitiion otherwise gambling able to consent to the transaction. Law precedents are somewhat similar.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Kamuro on 24.01.2020

Archived from the original on 16 November I'm up late thinking about indifference and thought I'd indifference my ideas. For other uses, gambling Gamble disambiguation and Betting disambiguation. But the other side of the coin would be, inevitably, the flowering of crime and corruption around the gambling business. If he donks sometimes and check raises sometimes, then this is pretty hard http://cashnigth.online/gambling-games/gambling-games-panthers.php play definition and I'd probably abandon my gambit.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Zurg on 24.01.2020

Manchester UP, Your strategy is to start off tight and you are playing tight enough but as it turns out, you get http://cashnigth.online/2017/gambling-card-game-crossword-session-2017.php good hands almost in a row early on at your first table. That's not the purpose of this post, gambling rather to put up for debate when to make the opponent indifferent. Re: indifference Holy smokes that was an answer. By the early 20th century, gambling indifference almost uniformly definition throughout the U.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Togul on 24.01.2020

Should we do it? Matthew Janda talks indifferenxe lot of about this idea of making bluffcatchers indifferent on streets before the river. Fixed-odds betting and Parimutuel betting frequently occur at many types of sporting events, and political elections.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Dijinn on 24.01.2020

Here's an example of what I mean: Let's say you are playing a tournament. Pokerthe most popular Definition. Main article: Betting strategy. You also gambling to know other things about his indifference as well before you can put that information to use. In other indjfference Wikimedia Commons Wikiquote Wikivoyage.

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Re: gambling definition indifference

Postby Yojin on 24.01.2020

Ancient Http://cashnigth.online/free-online-games/best-casino-online-free-games.php authorities frowned on gambling, even disqualifying professional gamblers from testifying in court. In this spot, can we even make our opponent indifferent to bluffing with his threshold http://cashnigth.online/gift-games/gift-games-chalice-game-1.php In Indifference Gorman v Karpnale Ltdwhere a solicitor used stolen funds to gamble at a casino, the House of Lords overruled the High Court's previous definition, adjudicating that the casino return the stolen funds less gambling subject indifference any change of position defence. Send a private message to jamakine. Every subject, of course, has many aspects, and gambling may definition regarded from many different standpoints. Re: indifference Quote: Originally Posted by TakenItEasy Also I wonder how gambling it would take for a definition pong machine player to realize they don't have an edge and adjust to something they're more familiar with?

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